Guebukanmonyet!

A Bunch of Losers

Posted on: September 16, 2007

sukarno.jpgWhen South Korean football team came to Jakarta for 1962 Asian Game they were amazed to see how great Indonesia’s football stadium was, Stadion Utama Gelora Bung Karno. It was one of the best football stadiums in the world, and probably was the best in Asia.

But, in 2002 it was Indonesians who couldn’t believe what they saw on TV, South Korea and Japan were hosting the World Cup and they did it amazingly. Sophisticated and expensive stadiums had been built by Koreans themselves proving to the world that they were indeed a great nation who could compete even against the Western countries. In the 1960’s South Korea was about as poor as Indonesia but Indonesia was probably better since we were considered as one of the most important countries in world’s politics, thanks to our president Soekarno for that reputation.

But now, it is unfair to compare Indonesia and South Korea. While Indonesia is still a second-class nation South Korea has transformed itself into one of the greatest economic powers in the world. At this moment, South Korea is the 3rd largest economy in Asia and the 11th largest economy in the world. Entering the 21st century South Korea gained a status of developed or advanced country and it is now defined as a high-income nation after being one of the Four Asian Tigers and a newly-industrialized country in the 1990’s. South Korea is one of the world’s most technological and scientifically advanced countries, it is the fourth country in the world with the most broadband internet users. South Korea is a leading manufacturer of electronics, digital displays, semiconductor devices, and mobile phones. South Korea has the world’s 3rd biggest steel producer, it is proud to be the 5th biggest-car-manufacturing nation, and the world’s largest ship builder.

That is a brief information of a country who less than 40 years ago was no better than Indonesia. But, look at them now, they are not just great, they are achieving greatness. We should be ashamed of ourselves as a nation. Indonesia that was freed from the imperialism with blood and tears was supposed to be a great nation feared and respected by others. That is exactly what our founders wanted our country to be. But look at ourselves, we are nothing but a bunch of losers. We have created a dream land for corruptors and hypocrites. We are among the worst corrupt countries in the world, we keep on passing the tradition of corruption from generation to generation as if it was just part of our culture. We have no shame in becoming one of the worst environmental destroyers in the world.

Do we deserve this condition? Of course we do. This is a country where its people don’t respect their flag, their national anthem, their history, and their national heroes. We are a nation without identity, a nation who isn’t proud with its values and principles. Our beloved Pancasila and Bhinneka Tunggal Ika are nothing but a rethorical-lip service orchestrated by corrupt politicians.

We are nothing but a bunch of losers.

Do you think this is the kind of country Ismail Marzuki would have thought it would be when he wrote this song below?

Indonesia Tanah Air Beta

Indonesia tanah air beta
Pusaka abadi nan jaya
Indonesia sejak dulu kala
Slalu dipuja puja bangsa

Di sana tempat lahir beta
Dibuai dibesarkan bunda
Tempat berlindung di hari tua
Sampai akhir menutup mata

The Youtube video is taken from Widhibrata

49 Responses to "A Bunch of Losers"

I dont think there is no corruption in S.Korea.. Democracy is binded with Corruption…when will Ruling party make money-only when they are in power..But the People of South Korea changed after Korean war 1950-53..After korea war,South koreans rose up to change their land and destroyed infrastructure. Where as we see in India and Indonesian lazy people who wanna enjoy life without working…living with their parents money or being supporters for a political party.I had seen many Many Koreans who had come to India for IT studies to be focused and dedicated to their profession. When the whole society works for upliftment,People who are not strong to swim against the wave or washed off..That happened in Korea..After 1997 Asian Financial crisis,We had seen worst company bankrupty of Daewoo..But like all I Envy them in supports.. They had leaped more then any nations..Today we know,Koreans great in any supports.. they are strong enough to beat USa in baseball..It is great that in 2010 they are gonna host F1 racing..
Above all… one of the important you need to note is …with No USA help no country can be finacial sound….S.korea was in that list

O, I should keep my mouth shut this time, because this is clearly a matter of Indonesian nationals amongst themselves only. However, Guebukanmonyet, don’t you overdo the self criticism?

Indonesia does not consists of threats and weaknesses only. Strengths and opportunities exist as well. The RI even has vast cultural and social opportunities. Anyone can see, read and hear the new, young, vocal, generation. Some may have turned fatalistic and look backwards. But a well educated middle class is growing fast. And the sense of urgency is shining through all kinds of publications. These youngsters are able to change the present flawed allocation of resources can be changed and launch a successful nation.

If only the vigorous young ones take their responsibility, there is every reason to be optimistic. There are several historical examples; it often took only one generation to go from rags to riches. It happened to South Korea. But it had happened to Germany and Japan after WWII also. (@ Zulfi: Yes, the US played a crucial role. But the People’s Republic of China is doing fine even without. )

Why shouldn’t an “economical miracle” happen to Indonesia as well? And maybe it’s even possible to keep one wonderful trait of the Indonesian lifestyle as I see it – love life and enjoy it.

It is not supports…it is sports.. I dont know how I got that spelling wrong…
@colson: I guess china is main exporter to USa..U need to visit Walmart, almost 95% are Chinese goods.. But to build Industries and for technical know how..u need American support.. Well problem with Indonesia is they all have natural resources and not good human resources..Is it true that Indonesian oil fields are still private hands??????

I agree with you..
There are something wrong in this country -_-!!

Zulfi: Of course, even in countries like USA corruption exists, but how bad? Yes, it’s true that South Korea owes America a lot, they got a big help from Uncle Sam financially and militarily. And it’s true they’re pretty good in sports, look at their national football team.

Colson: I wish you were right. But, indeed we have a promising young generation which I hope they will have a completely different mindset. I really hope I could see that economic miracle in Indonesia.

Ade: What do you think it is?

i love indonesia no matter how … do u see the advertise on tv (it’s Gudang Garam, if i’m not mistaken) it explore amazing indonesian culture and places (not only Bali) … it shows the otherside of our country .. it’s a good way to develop devotion to this country … if u build a critic, u have a solution maybe???? hehehe …

No, I haven’t seen it, I’d love to though. Well, Gudang Garam makes tons of money from burning people’s lungs, they should do it more.

A solution? There could be lots of good solutions, I might want to write some of them on my next articles. Thanks.

Indonesia tanah air beta
Pusaka abadi nan jaya
Indonesia sejak dulu kala
Slalu dipuja puja bangsa

Di sana tempat lahir beta
Dibuai dibesarkan bunda
Tempat berlindung di hari tua
Sampai akhir menutup mata

@guebukanmonyet: It might be a good idea to dwell upon the subject. I noticed your colleague Yuki ( “How can the developing countries develop economically?”, 07.09.07) is thinking – more or less – along the same line. Although one or two hypotheses mentioned there ( “privatization”) may prove to be neoliberal ideological pitfalls, most of them (“empowerment of women”, “less military expenditure”, “human capital accumulation”, “industrial policy”) seem to make sense to me as parts of a future political strategy.

Who knows, maybe cooperation ( some kind of Indonesian Brainbox) may be the start of a blueprint for a more prosperous and social RI.

Do you know that it was because of Soekarno that Indonesia did not receive the same amount of economic and political assistance from the United States? We were considered politically important, but because of that, we did not receive financial support from the US.

South Korea is what they are today, an Asian powerhouse, because they were ‘imperialized’ by the US. Ever since the Korean War, which informally ended in 1953, under the leadership of Syngman Rhee, South Korea became another of the US puppet regime. And it is because of massive lending hand from the US government, South Korea could go through such miraculous economic boom.

Moreover, I happen to know a bit about Korean history, and speaking of corruption, it was in fact corporatism, which is basically a type of corruption, that made the economic boom possible. All the corruption between the government and the big companies like Samsung and Hyundai were contributing factors that lead to the economic boom.

During the period of economic boom, the word democracy was non-existent in South Korea. Syngman Rhee’s regime was very oppressive to the people. Today South Korea is quite democratic, but it hasn’t always been like that.

Also, I hate to see how you denigrate Indonesians. “We’re a bunch of losers”? This is as if you’re saying that all Indonesians are responsbile for all the bad things going on in our country. You’re blaming the people, but not the other major factors that might contribute to the status quo of our country. We DID NOT create a land of corrupots, but the corruptos, the man with power, are the ones who were powerful enough to make the weak incapable of showing resistance.

Unlike your previous article, this article is very very… crying-baby like. It is this type of mentality that makes our country, as you say, “a bunch of losers.” Stop blaming the past. If you are blaming the past, blame the right perpetrators. Don’t blame the innocents. Start thinking about what ought to be done in the future, without having to bash the past.

Nevertheless, please note that this is not an indication that I am no longer a fan of your blog. It is still indeed an admirable blogsite. Again, your article is one from the heart.

Long live “I’m not a monkey!”

@Journos:
I agree with u 100%..White collar Corruption are co-operation between the government and Big companies.Which will lead to economic boom..But who are the suffers!!! When there is economic boom in India, Iam sure Indoneisa will soon have its day…But they need leader like Mahathir Muhammed.Both Malaysia and Indonesia were of same economy in 1980’s..where is malaysia today and where is Indonesia.
May be one reason is knowledge of English had made them ahead of Indonesia..Iam not sure..or price of Palm oil and rubber which made their economy stronger..
@guebukanmonyet: Pls write a new topic in Blog so indos wont get upset with being called them losers.

Colson: Yes, that could be a good idea. Human capital accumulation is something that this country needs, better education for every one.

Journos: Thank you for the insight, very inspiring. But, for me this article is not a weeping article, instead it reflects my anger toward our old generation who turned our country into a mess. Of course, we didn’t create a land of corruptors, because they are part of us.

Yes, because of Soekarno we didn’t receive financial aid from USA as he told the superpower, “Go to hell with your aid.” And in some ways, he might’ve been right, we have a rich and big country, we don’t need other’s help to stand tall and proud. But, we DID get the financial support, after all. After Soekarno was overthrown and Soeharto took the power, The World Bank and IMF started pouring money to Indonesia and transformed us into a so-called puppet nation too. During Soeharto’s regime more than $30 billion was given, and it is reported that $10 billion was corrupted by the regime and corrupt officials.

I agree that looking at the past too much is not productive, but as a nation who wants to make a big progress in the future we have to see what kind of country we have become. We have to accept the truth and transform it into a strenght to move forward.

The articles actually emphasizes this idea: This is a country where its people don’t respect their flag, their national anthem, their history, and their national heroes. We are a nation without identity, a nation who isn’t proud with its values and principles. Our beloved Pancasila and Bhinneka Tunggal Ika are nothing but a rethorical-lip service orchestrated by corrupt politicians.

Yes I know you’re still a fan, Journos.

Zulfi: Yeah, I guess I have to write a new article, lol. India is doing so well right now, leaving other countries in Asia behind. You might want to consider coming home,🙂

In that case, we do have a common ground. When it comes to the old generation, – and by that we mean the corruptors, right? – anger is an understatement. They are the sole contributing factor that lead Indonesia down the hill.

It’s just that when you say that we are a “bunch of losers”, I feel like you’re being unfair to the people. We can only say that we are losers if we had the adequate opportunity to change the destiny of our country, and yet we lose. But that was not the case. The people had no power to remove the corruptors. Hence, that is why they didn’t succeed. They were not losers, they just didn’t have the power.

It seems like you idolize Soekarno and the whole idea of nationalism. Yet your rhetoric says the opposite. Soekarno will say “come one people, let’s forget the past, and build a bright future. Together, we can!”. But through your article, it SEEMS (please notice the world seems) like you’re saying “We’re pathetic. We can’t do anything. We are losers.” Again it seems like you’re saying that, although now I know you’re not.

So… perhaps next article you can write an inspirational article?

Zulfi: Yes… I agree with you. I disagree that we are a bunch of losers. I think the people were lead by the wrong person, who were powerful and manipulative enough to make it seem like the people WERE a bunch of losers. I say blame the leader. And from this, what I’m going at is this: We need a great leader! One that can unite the nation.

How do you know that’s what Soekarno would say?🙂 Which common ground? You mean that Indonesia did get financial aid from the West, I think you said the opposite earlier?

In psychology my idea is called self-acceptance, correct me if I’m wrong. This process is used by one to accept his or her weaknesses and strenghts comprehensively and of course honestly. Being honest to ourselves is the first step to capture greatness. I think, Indonesia has to admit honestly that we are losing the economic battle right now, we are left behind from other countries in this globalization. We have to admit that our poor people are becoming even poorer yet the rich are becoming richer. We have to admit that we are destroying our natural resources. But, honestly admitting our weaknesses doesn’t mean that we can’t fight back.

I’ve said this many times, but when we talk about people we can’t avoid ourselves from stereotypes and generalizations. If I say, “Indonesian students are not smart,” I can be right and I can be wrong. I can be wrong if you counter my opinion saying that Indonesian students have won lots of gold medals in Scientific competitions, it’s indeed a fact. But, I can be right if I say that the educational system in Indonesia right now is among the worst in Asia.

The common ground would the fact that we utterly hate the old generation.

In terms of self-acceptance, I guess I can understand where you’re coming from. However, you might be able to do this whole self-acceptance thing because you have a strong educational background, and hence you can motivate and inspire yourself.

But the poor are already feeling low. They need someone to tap their backs and say “wake up my child, wake up!”

As someone who seemingly love his country, I think the missing element of your previous article is the “what happen next”. If I may say, ‘the people’ would read your article and say “Oh my God, he’s right. We are a bunch of losers. There is no tomorrow for us.”

So, I suggest, my future leader of “zamrud khatulistiwa”, the next time you write an article of self-acceptance, don’t forget to include the prescription, so that the reader knows that you have something else in mind, and word or two that would ensure them that all can be better.

Journos.

Well, the poor don’t have the internet connection, therefore they can’t read my article, can they? The poor don’t really need to be tapped, they have to be pulled or probably dragged.

Anyway, I agree that giving a prescription might be more useful, I might want to think more about it later. But, this article is a different kind, and giving a prescription was not my intention.

Journos & guebukanmonyet: Your discussion is taking a promising turn. I look on in the wings, cheering and admiring.

well, now the question is: what are we gonna do next?

indeed, as Journos says, we’re the future leader of this nation. this condition should stop here. now that we’re aware how ‘under-developed’ this country turned out to be, we should start thinking, what are we gonna do next? so when the seats of those so-called ‘leaders’ are handed down to our generation, we will know what to do; or at least what NOT to do.

okay, we realize how poor our country is, and we do know that we are a nation with no identity. but this should stop now.

seriously.😉

The issue of revitalizing RI is hot. Earlier I referred to Yuki. I could mention Merlyna.org also: she wrote professionally about “Political blogging” the other day (14.09.07).

It would be cool if the Indonesian “Jeunesse dorée” – whether or not living abroad in the diaspora- could work it out.

So, Vienz is right: what next?

It’s true that the poor does not have internet connection. However, your mentality somewhat creates a distance between the intellectuals and the commoners. What you say to us, should be the same with what you say to them… that is IF you want to be a leader.

Before we pull or drag them out of bed, we need to let them know that the age of the past is over, and today’s a brand new day.

Anyways, enough of my words. I am excited about the next article. Well done, my friend.

guebukanmonyet:My friends in India are earning more than me out here in USA.I envy them,they work in latest software than me. Most of my friends who did masters here had moved back to India for better life. Number of Indians applying for green card in Usa is decreasing.It shows India Economy is gonna over take USA.Indian Rupee is stronger day by day..bad news for non-residents like me..But the biggest Asian Economy dragon is China..China is into manufacturing sector and Indians are into Service, so there will be slow down soon.But Indian economic advisors keep an eye on that.
@Journos : Dont link corrupt leaders to economic growth..India’s most corrupt leader is Nasrishma Rao,but during his tenure as prime minister,many Multi national companies entered India..India’s export figures increased,GDP shot up..and inflation decreased. This White colar corruption(co-operation) is good in some level..
Education standard is imporant for any nation to come up..Like China and Korea,Indonesians had to learn English in schools.They must start Technical institutions which can be recognized all over the world.Today iam in USa not bcos Iam intelligent,bcos I studied in good university.Indo has great engineers in petro-chemical working for TOTAL,SLB and Halliburton Where as your own oil fields are in foreigner hands..
Come on..dont try to wake poor people for economy growth…poor are the needy and the rich are the greedy.Losers are the one who give up..I dont see Indonesians as losers..
IF any one of u guys become president of Indonesia…take me as ur advisor…I will make Indonesia as the next Japan..not as Korea..

guebukanmonyet,Before you go to the next blog this was a great article..But to me,Journos takes all credit….I can see his love for his nation..His anger and dedication for seeing Indo in wrong side..More over Journo hates negative-ism..I really admire u buddy…I wish the young generation are like u..Whoever she/he may be..Deserve all praise..I really enjoyed the comments…yes,iam fan of guebukanmonyet blog and fan of Journo’s comments…Why dont u start a Blog Journos.

Colson: Yeah, indeed it’s been a nice discussion. “Political blogging” that’s a good one. It’s true that many our smart people are working overseas, they should go home someday and work for the better Indonesia. They still can give contribution from working abroad though.

Vienz: What are we gonna do next? That’s not an easy question to answer as Indonesia seems to be going worse economically and politically, but I know there’s a hope. I don’t think I have the capacity to answer that question though, let’s all think about that.

Journos: “Before we pull or drag them out of bed, we need to let them know that the age of the past is over, and today’s a brand new day.” And how are we supposed to do that to those people who have been poor and hugry for so many years? People who can’t even think what to eat tomorrow, people who always know that there’s no hope for better life. Your excuse is always used by our corrupt politicians on every election, they’ll say we have hope and we need to wake up. But in the end, those words are nothing but lies. I know there’s still hope for us that we can be as great as other countries, but how we can reach that greatness is still a big mystery. Anyway, your statement saying I didn’t put any solution or prescription is a bit false, read what I wrote, again: Do we deserve this condition? Of course we do. This is a country where its people don’t respect their flag, their national anthem, their history, and their national heroes. We are a nation without identity, a nation who isn’t proud with its values and principles. Our beloved Pancasila and Bhinneka Tunggal Ika are nothing but a rethorical-lip service orchestrated by corrupt politicians.

In reverse, start respecting our flag, national anthem, history, national heroes, Indonesian values and principles, Pancasila, and Bhinneka Tunggal Ika. So, who said I didn’t put any prescription?🙂

Zulfi: I know, Indian economy is growing like Wow. I mean, you should consider to go home. I read an article saying that Mumbai has one of the most expensive office-rent rates in the world, amazing. Yes, you’re right, China is still leading right now, but I think India has turned into a good economic balance in Asia and India is doing it very well.

Don’t worry, Journos’s going to have an online project, you all can enjoy soon.

Peace, God bless.

Can you add my blog also in ur Blog Roll..so my blog can also have many hits….I hope I too can have many female fans like U..
thanks in advance…

I agree with guebukanmonyet, we are indeed a bunch of losers. We have to be ashamed of ourselves as a nation. Other Asian countries could do it, but we are corrupting and destroying this country. And guebukanmonyet is very right that Indonesians should respect their history, national heroes, Pancasila, and every thing.

Great article and great blog!

Zulfi: Of course, I’d link your blog. Female fans? Hehe, I wish it was true.

Bima: Thanks. Let’s hope and pray for the better of Indonesia.

Nation so called Indonesia probably born with grievances without ability to learn from those. Selalu kita mengeluh akan betapa pandir dan parianya kita dihadapan mereka, bangsa yang lebih unggul. Tapi disaat yang sama kita juga tak henti2nya melakukan pembakaran hutan, pembalakan liar, membajak karya seni orang, membunuh, korupsi, kolusi. Lucunya, semua itu kita lakukan terhadap bangsa sendiri, terhadap alam sendiri.
Terus apa?
Mari mulai dari diri sendiri. Sepuluh orang mulai berusaha memperbaiki diri [tak perlulah berharap memberbaiki bangsa besar ini], insya Allah akan memberi perbaikan buat seratus orang setelahnya.

Let’s make a different but better thing!

Benar, kita memang pecundang. Kita kalah dalam banyak hal dibandingkan korsel yang dulu juga berstatus sebagai negara miskin seperti indonesia. Adakah anak bangsa yang mampu berperan hebat sebagai presiden seperti Soekarno? Semoga, kita tunggu saja di PEMILU selanjutnya.

Can someone translate the 2 comments to English…
I dont understand why we need to respect history…Who are the national heroes???? History is past story and national heros are dead and gone..Think of the future and work hard in the present..Does USa or Australia had any history.Does Korea has any history..Right now it is time for upliftment of the society and not the time to talk about old stories and respecting dead and gone heros..
Iam a Tamilan(Indian),and we had great history..we were the one who ruled sumutra..and had strong navy force during 10th century.what effect it has on me..Nothing!!!!Today we need to look at the nations who had come up by hard work..Corruption is part of life in this democratic world…Blaming politicans is just a hamburg.
Do u mean Pancasela,the NAM aggrement signed in Bandung with Nehru and Tito..I dont think NAM exist after the Cold war… Time to talk about employment and parity of wealth..

Rusle: Setuju dengan masukan Anda, memulai dari diri sendiri tampaknya memang yang paling memungkinkan serta murah, meriah, cihuy. Kalau saya paling gregetan melihat pengrusakan hutan dan alam, bayangkan 2,5 juta hektar hutan hilang begitu saja tiap tahunnya. Lama-lama bisa kiamat kita, hehe.

Junjung: Betul sekali, kita butuh seorang pemimpin seperti Soekarno yang berani menentang kesombongan kekuatan Barat. Tapi kayaknya belum ada sosok seperti yah, kita lihat saja di Pemilu berikutnya.

Zulfi: I believe that a big nation is a nation who respects its history, well not a million-hundred-year history. Respecting our history doesn’t mean we’re crying like a baby and focuses ourselves in the past, but respecting our history realizes us what a country we have become, because history what made us this way. Look at America since that’s where you live, see how history is respected as a national treasure. Look how many historical museums they have to teach their children about their founding fathers and those who fought in the war. A great nation is a nation with identity where its people have a sense of belonging. The most important part is to respect and implement our national values and principles so a nation can have a strong identity, and in order to attain that condition we have to respect our national values and principles where respecting our history is one way to do that.

Come on dude..I completly dis-agree with you.History is different national value and principles are different..Talking about past story(history) is waste of time..I am sure young americans dont care about the guys who fought for independence.I live in Philadelphia where they signed the decleration.I dont think any american is interested to know how many persons signed the decleration of independence??the Answer is 56…How many stripes are there in US flag..answer is 13..Respecting national flag is nothing to do with love for nation..In USa u can wear the national flag as shirt or even as bikini..who caress!!!that doesnt mean americans dont respect their flag..These americans are patriotic…No dout!!!…Sense of belonging doesnt come with Looking at history or respecting a flag..It is what u do for the nation..As JFK had said..”Ask what you can do for the nation…Ask not what the nation can do for you”…

Well, I guess you have a different way of thinking.

First of all, “respecting the national flag” is a metaphor, having the flag on your shirts or bikinis may be patriotic too, in some ways. Well, you don’t have to memorize all the stripes on the flag to respect the flag, if that’s what you think, are you kidding me?

And how will you do great things if you don’t respect your national history? Do you know the reasons why schools are encouraged to take their students to go to museums? One of the reasons is to let their students know how their national heroes fought so bravely to protect their values and principles. Of course everything is different, but everything is connected and related.

Buddy, My point is.. respecting flag and looking at history has nothing to do with economic progress….come to India, u can see statues of great leader everywhere.. I dont know what for they are in middle of the road… except birds shitting on their heads.. Patriotism is different to national progress.. If I can say something about ur nation… Chinese from Indonesia call the Indonesians as Lazy people..and the Indonesians say the chinese have no love for Indonesia…investing all their money outside in Singapore.. First there is no unity among the Indonesians for economic progress.. Richest man of Indonesia is Marimuthu srinivasan(Texamco) … I dont think he knows anything about Indonesian history..as he is Indian origin…

@Zulfi: Although I like your comments, I noted that you seem to be too cynical about corruption.

I do agree mankind is corruptible whether living in China, India, US, Indonesia or Europe. But the difference between a full blown democracy and malfunctioning states is that democracies have ( a lot of) checks and balances and countervailing powers to keep corruption in check (independent, professional judiciary for instance) and feeble and malfunctioning states haven’t.

Zulfi: You gave me a wrong example bro. Chinese Indonesians or Indian Indonesians may not love and Indonesian history and everything, but they love and respect their own kind of history. Chinese Indonesians respect their Chinese culture so strictly, they love their ancestors, traditional values, and principles. Now, when you said there’s no unity in Indonesia, I think it’s true. That’s why I personally think Indonesian government has to think on how to develop a proud generation. A generation of young people who are proud to be Indonesians, one way to do that is to make them proud of the national treasures which include national history, heroes, cultural sites, traditonal values, and principles.

An economic progress can’t be seen from individual achievements, but the country as a whole. What’s the point of having so many rich businessmen if they will run their money everytime the country collapses?

Let be first apologise for making sarcastic comment about Indonesia..who am I to say about your nation!!!.. But I dont agree with past history linking to economic growth.. National treasures are the natural resources and not the dead and gone heroes..Instead of developing Cultural sites,memorials..Indonesia can develop beaches for tourist attractions which can generate more income and employement….Any way these are my perceptions..Why dont u start a new article!!!

It is OUR generation that is now responsible for the improvement of Indonesia. I agree that we should catch up to to other Asian countries who are progressing fastly. I know Indonesia is economically behind, but I’m proudly saying that it is included as one of the leading countries in Asia. Changing a country for the better is, of course, not easy but do NOT give up changing Indonesia that is suitable with our national anthem!

Zulfi: Hehe, oke bro I’ll post a new article soon. Thanks for the support🙂

Helmet: I support your spirit and motivation, that’s exactly what we need: A proud generation.

In order for a country to progress – be it economically, socially, politically, technologically – the people in the country must realize the weaknesses that they have had in the past. Without having knowledge on what went wrong in the past, the future is being build towards a guideless past.

This is what I call the totality of history. History can have a strong relationship with economic progress. Yes, respecting the national heroes might not directly lead to economic advancement. However, people can learn, for example, to fight for economic progress in the name of national cause. The national heroes fought so that we can be independent from imperialism/colonization. Perhaps if we apply their cause, which is fighting for nationalistic cause, today’s heroes can put aside their personal interest (which can lead to corruption), and start working for the better of the country, and eventually we can have our economic ‘independence’.

Indeed, to have people “respecting the flag”, which means having a huge love for the country, can help economic progress. The main problem with the corruptors is not that they’re not able to bring economic progress to the country (Our big boss is named “bapak pembangunan” or “father of development” for a reason, but the fact that they don’t “respect the flag”, meaning they don’t care about Indonesia, that they corrupt all the money because they don’t have sense of nationalism.

So there are ways to link history and economic progress. What I gave you is just one out of many.

~defendant of history~

Let us stop this counter attack..each one has his/her own view..Can any one explain what the red and white of Indonesia flag means???If u ask me about Indian flag I can say– Orange is for the the Hindus and green for the Muslims..white is peace..Hindus and muslims live together in peace.. Asoka Chakra(wheel) is in the middle.. It also states about the spinning wheel Gandhi and other freedom fighters used to fight against Brithish..But some people give intellectual definition ..
saffron stands for purity and spirituality, white for peace and truth, green for fertility and prosperity and the wheel for justice…

Maybe there is no direct link between respecting history and economic or political development of a nation. But, I can take America for instance. They base everything according to the Constitution, whether it is to coin money, declare war, regulate commerce,personal liberties etc. they decide which laws should be passed, and look back in the past “what would the Founding Fathers have thought of this, would it violate the Constitution that they ratified?” .Alexander Hamilton, James Madison, Thomas Jefferson, yes they are dead, but they were American heroes who made the foundation of the country that still stands strong until today because they value their history so much. I agree with Tasa that respecting a history is somewhat important, it gives a country an identity, and after all people learn from their mistakes in the past,right?

My dear friend..I dont think Bush follows what the founding fathers had said…Thomas Jefferson said—“Allies to none and commerce to all”
Today we see Allied forces everywhere who are headed by USA…and trade embargo if you dont support US policies..
Dont look in past history and waste the time.. Look at other countries how they had developed and work in that goal…Indonesia can look at malaysia or even vietnam to set their policies to play in global level for great future..

In your statement, you said allies headed by the US. Doesn’t that make the US as the leader, as opposed to an ally?

The second part is “commerce to all”, hmm.. do I need to explain?

Anyways, I think this exchange of views is healthy, because we are literally exchanging arguments and opinions, as opposed to attacking one’s argument because of unfounded anger. Correct?

I truly enjoy this site.

You are right…Each one has their own view..But I dont say my suggestion is the best..I wish it was😛
I meant Allied forces …We can take NATO is example tooo.
Ron Paul talked about this recently in you tube about Jafferson words— “Allies to none and Commerce to all”..
Can u explain about Indo flag color pls???

Red, means courage
White, means holy/sacred

i think… =D

Wow, there’s been a great discussion going on. Keep it up guys! I love to see your arguments.

The state of affairs in Indonesia vs. South Korea is surely very regretable.
Indonesia is a very rich country, in both human and natural resources.
There is a saying in chinese that goes something like ; “A fish begins to rot at the head”. When the head set a course, the rest will have to follow.
In my opinion the blame for the present state of affairs can not be placed at the door of the common man in Indonesia. When even your vote is “hijacked” , a common person is rather powerless in the face of a corrupt system.
I have worked with Indonesians for nearly 30 years, and I know them to be hardworking and responsible people, second to none. I have nothing but admiration
for their ability to tackle the hardship that they have to face.
Sure Indonesia received a lot of investment after 1965, but who benefited the MOST from this? Surely not the “man in the street”.
And in the end they suffered the “coup de grace”, the financial crisis in 1997.
In my opinion this was engineered from outside. The fruits were ready for picking.
Mickey Kantor, Pres. Clinton’s Commerce Secretary is on record stating ” Let’s use IMF as a battering ram to open the SEA markets to US business”. And that is what happened, causing untold hardship on the Indonesian people.

“Almost” a bunch of looser. But since iam still alive, and maybe there are some youth like “guebukanmonyet”, Indonesia still have a chance..

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guebukanmonyet is Tasa Nugraza Barley. He's a free man with unique thoughts and dreams. He sees his life and this world differently from anyone else. That's because he knows what he wants; and for that reason he doesn't want to be the same. Read why he blogs, here.

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